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Opened 2 years ago

Last modified 7 days ago

#17606 new enhancement

[Patch] piste:type validation improvement

Reported by: yvecai Owned by: team
Priority: normal Milestone:
Component: Core validator Version:
Keywords: piste, ski Cc:

Description (last modified by Klumbumbus)

While piste:difficulty is more than just useful for the data user, piste:grooming for crosscountry skiing appears to be defaults to quite different practises across the world.

  • combinations.mapcss

    old new  
    119119/* {0.tag} without {1.key} (warning level) */
    120120node[emergency=fire_hydrant][!fire_hydrant:type],
    121121way[     boundary=administrative][!admin_level],
     122way[piste:type=nordic][!piste:grooming][!piste:difficulty],
     123way[piste:type=downhill][!piste:difficulty],
    122124relation[boundary=administrative][!admin_level],
    123125relation[route=bicycle ][!network][type=route],
    124126relation[route=hiking  ][!network][type=route],

Attachments (1)

combinations.mapcss.patch (548 bytes) - added by yvecai 2 years ago.
patch file

Download all attachments as: .zip

Change History (9)

Changed 2 years ago by yvecai

Attachment: combinations.mapcss.patch added

patch file

comment:1 Changed 2 years ago by Klumbumbus

Description: modified (diff)
Type: defectenhancement

comment:2 Changed 3 months ago by yvecai

What can be done to get this into consideration?

comment:3 Changed 3 months ago by skyper

Summary: piste:type validation improvement[Patch] piste:type validation improvement

Add [Patch] to the summary. Ping, like you did.

Mmh, I usually tag the piste:difficulty in the piste's route relation and not on each individual way. As I seldom have proper data for the correct incline of each small part I wonder how to tag each way correctly, especially in areas with forest.

I would include skitour, additionally.

comment:4 Changed 3 months ago by Klumbumbus

I'm not sure if the patch does what you actually want. Please describe in words which warnings you want, e.g.

  • piste:type=nordic without piste:grooming
  • ...

comment:5 in reply to:  3 ; Changed 8 days ago by anonymous

Replying to skyper:

Add [Patch] to the summary. Ping, like you did.

Mmh, I usually tag the piste:difficulty in the piste's route relation and not on each individual way. As I seldom have proper data for the correct incline of each small part I wonder how to tag each way correctly, especially in areas with forest.

I would include skitour, additionally.

@Skyper: Actually, the easiest way to gather data about difficulty is with your skis ;-)

comment:6 in reply to:  4 Changed 8 days ago by anonymous

Replying to Klumbumbus:

I'm not sure if the patch does what you actually want. Please describe in words which warnings you want, e.g.

  • piste:type=nordic without piste:grooming
  • ...

@Klumbubus The goal is :

  • to give a warning at validation if piste:type=nordic is present, but not piste:grooming=* nor piste:difficulty=*.
  • to give a warning at validation if piste:type=downhill is present, but not piste:difficulty=*.

comment:7 in reply to:  5 Changed 8 days ago by skyper

Replying to anonymous:

Replying to skyper:

Mmh, I usually tag the piste:difficulty in the piste's route relation and not on each individual way. As I seldom have proper data for the correct incline of each small part I wonder how to tag each way correctly, especially in areas with forest.

I would include skitour, additionally.

@Skyper: Actually, the easiest way to gather data about difficulty is with your skis ;-)

Yes, that is what I only do. Still I only have poor sources as GPS has problems with forest and in a country side with steeper inclines. The weather is not that stable which is a problem for ele measuring and I often forget about it or even do not find a source to calibrate my unit.

I usually do not stop every few meters to take pictures or make some written notes as I like to find my rhythm and have often no time as I want to make some distance.

Long story short, I think the quality of difficulty will be quite low if we start to tag it on every small way a piste uses. So, in my eyes, I stay with the relation and a general classification and would ignore this warning, most of the times. On the other hand, I wonder why relations are not checked at all.

I would prefer other instead of warning level for the difficulty tag on ways for nordic. Grooming is more important, e.g. check both tags separately, and include relations where I do not have a problem with warning level for both tags

way[piste:type =~ /^downhill|nordic|skitour$/][!piste:grooming],
relation[piste:type =~ /^downhill|nordic|skitour$/][!piste:grooming][type=piste],
relation[piste:type =~ /^downhill|nordic|skitour$/][!piste:difficulty][type=piste] {
  throwWarning();
}

way[piste:type =~ /^downhill|nordic|skitour$/][!piste:difficulty] {
  throwOther();
}
Last edited 7 days ago by skyper (previous) (diff)

comment:8 Changed 7 days ago by anonymous

Hello Skyper,
I agree with you concerning nordic ways grooming.

Downhill grooming is however documented as implicit unless stated otherwise. Maybe could be stated as such also for Skitour, as piste:grooming = classic seems to be rather exceptional and was documented only recently on the wiki.

For nordic difficulty, your practice is just the opposite as mine, so I guess this is not the good place to discuss.
About relations, your validation rules would be contradictory to the wiki documentation on route=piste. Incidentally I open a discussion this morning on the subject, so you may want to follow up here: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Key:piste:difficulty

I think it's good practice to align validation to the documentation, so let's discuss the subjects first and come back to this issue later on.
Regards, Yves

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