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Opened 11 months ago

Last modified 12 days ago

#14142 new enhancement

Rename "Toggle Dialogs" (sometimes "Windows") to "Panel"

Reported by: Klumbumbus Owned by: team
Priority: normal Milestone: 17.11
Component: Core Version:
Keywords: Cc: stoecker, bastiK, Don-vip, simon04, michael2402, wiktorn

Description

In JOSM and in the wiki we use both terms mixed. We should decide which one should be used, so it is easier to the user to understand. Currently this causes also problems like F1 on the "Windows" menu leads to the empty page Help/Menu/Windows?. (Content is currently on Help/ToggleDialogs).

I vote for "Windows" as this is easier to understand and already used most of the time.

Attachments (0)

Change History (39)

comment:1 Changed 11 months ago by michael2402

I don't like the term "ToggleDialog". Their visibility can be toggled by a button but this does not really qualify for this name.

The problem I see with "Windows" is, that users may confuse them with the other windows we have (main window, ...).

What about "Dockable Window"?

comment:2 Changed 11 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 16.1217.01
Type: defectenhancement

comment:3 Changed 10 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0117.02

comment:4 Changed 9 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0217.03

comment:5 Changed 9 months ago by michael2402

Can we decide on a name here?

comment:6 in reply to:  5 ; Changed 9 months ago by Klumbumbus

Replying to michael2402:

Can we decide on a name here?

+1

What about "Dockable Window"?

I would agree with this solution.

comment:7 Changed 8 months ago by stoecker

In 11769/josm:

see #14142 - fix help link

comment:8 Changed 8 months ago by stoecker

In 11770/josm:

see #14142 - fix another help link

comment:9 Changed 8 months ago by stoecker

"Dock" or "Dockable window" is fine for me as well (depending whether we need a short or long form). Long form should be preferred.

comment:10 in reply to:  6 Changed 8 months ago by Klumbumbus

Replying to Klumbumbus:

What about "Dockable Window"?

I would agree with this solution.

However, the docu would sound a bit strange, e.g.: "...open the Tags/Membership dockable window via the Dockable Window menu..." A single word would be better.

comment:11 Changed 8 months ago by Klumbumbus

I'm just wondering what the german transation for "dock" and "dockable window" would be.

comment:12 Changed 8 months ago by stoecker

http://www.linguee.com/english-german/search?source=auto&query=dockable+window --> Andockbares Fenster.

and ...open the Tags/Membership dockable window via the Window menu... sounds much better.

comment:13 in reply to:  12 Changed 8 months ago by Klumbumbus

Replying to stoecker:

http://www.linguee.com/english-german/search?source=auto&query=dockable+window --> Andockbares Fenster.

OK, but whats the german translation for the short form "dock"?

and ...open the Tags/Membership dockable window via the Window menu... sounds much better.

That would be inconsistent again, if we want to keep the term "window" for all the other "undockable pop up windows", see comment:1

comment:14 Changed 8 months ago by michael2402

Why not just call them Docks then?

In German, it is much easier to find a single word for everything: Andockfenster ;-)

comment:15 Changed 8 months ago by bastiK

I don't like dock as a noun too much, the primary association would be a maritime dock and the dock itself doesn't dock=attach to something, the ships that come into the harbor do. Compare the Dock in macOS, which is the global prominent taskbar at a fixed position.

We could call it "dockable window" whenever that sounds okay, and otherwise just "window". The short form makes no distinction between dockable and modal windows, but it can't be helped. At least everyone knows what a window is.

comment:16 Changed 8 months ago by Don-vip

Status of dockable windows in major software, how they name it:

  1. Eclipse: Views and Editors in the "Window" menu.
  2. Netbeans: Windows and Editors in the "Window" menu
  3. Visual Studio: Docking Windows in the "Window" menu
  4. Photoshop: Document Windows and Panels in the "Window" menu.
  5. GIMP: Dockable Dialogs in the "Windows" menu
  6. Blender: They chose to not implement dockable panels

The "Window" menu seems universal. I suggest to keep it.

Concerning the name, all English names suggested are fine so the translation should be our main concern. "Panel" is probably the easiest to translate in all languages and is short. In French we would go for "Fenêtre ancrable" for either "docking/dockable window/dialog" but "Panneau" is simpler.

comment:17 Changed 8 months ago by michael2402

For me, a window is something that I can move around the screen. The problem I see with just calling it window is, that most new users don't know that you can move them around.

Just looked around a bit...

Gimp: They call it "dockable dialogs" (German: Andockbare Dialoge), short form: Docks.
Incscape just calls it dialog in the docs, but often refers to it as "Dockable Dialogs" (or docked dialogs as long as they are really docked) and Floating dialogs.
Blender has a "Tool Shelf" (shelf) on the side of it's main window.
Photoshop calls them "Panel"

So we are left with some more names to confuse people: "panel", "dockable panel", "dialog", "dockable dialog", ... ;-)

Edit: Some seconds to slow ...
Edit 2: I agree that we should also unify the translations for this. We should always use the same word in very translated language. We will have the same problem again if we mix "Panel" with several native words for panel...

Last edited 8 months ago by michael2402 (previous) (diff)

comment:18 in reply to:  17 Changed 8 months ago by Don-vip

Replying to michael2402:

Edit: Some seconds to slow ...

Great minds think alike :)

comment:19 Changed 8 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0317.04

comment:20 Changed 8 months ago by bastiK

+1 for panel

comment:21 Changed 7 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0417.05

comment:22 Changed 6 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0517.06

comment:23 Changed 5 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0617.07

comment:24 Changed 4 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0717.08

comment:25 Changed 4 months ago by michael2402

Summary: unify naming "Windows" vs. "Toggle Dialogs"Rename "Toggle Dialogs" (sometimes "Windows") to "Panel"

comment:26 Changed 4 months ago by Klumbumbus

German translation would be "Panel" and plural "Panels" then, right? http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Panel

comment:27 in reply to:  26 ; Changed 4 months ago by stoecker

Replying to Klumbumbus:

German translation would be "Panel" and plural "Panels" then, right? http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Panel

Nein, das ist die Übersetzung der falschen Bedeutung: http://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/panel

Paneel → Paneele wäre die richtige Form. Wobei mir Feld oder Tafel besser gefallen würde.

comment:28 in reply to:  27 Changed 4 months ago by michael2402

Replying to stoecker:

Replying to Klumbumbus:

German translation would be "Panel" and plural "Panels" then, right? http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Panel

Nein, das ist die Übersetzung der falschen Bedeutung: http://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/panel

Paneel → Paneele wäre die richtige Form. Wobei mir Feld oder Tafel besser gefallen würde.

Paneel/Paneele is acceptable. The problem with "Feld" and "Tafel" is that they do not relate to the English word. It will be hard to tell this to translators and even harder for people that are not translators but simply use JOSM in a multi-lingual setting (e.g. English tutorials, ...)

comment:29 Changed 4 months ago by Klumbumbus

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panel

Bei wikipadia würde Panel passen "Panel, in der Informatik ein einfaches grafisches Gestaltungselement, das von einem Layoutmanager positioniert wird."

wohingegen Paneel mit zwei e: "Paneel, im Sinne von (Holz-)Täfelung bzw. Wand- oder Deckenverkleidung"

comment:30 in reply to:  29 Changed 4 months ago by stoecker

Replying to Klumbumbus:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panel

Bei wikipadia würde Panel passen "Panel, in der Informatik ein einfaches grafisches Gestaltungselement, das von einem Layoutmanager positioniert wird."

That's no translation, but taking the English word. Sometimes this is the best solution. I'm not so sure in this case for an element which has enough German translation possibilities. The informatics "Panel" in German is not really used by end-users, only by developers and scientists (and also pronounced like the English word BTW).

Replying to michael2402:

Paneel/Paneele is acceptable. The problem with "Feld" and "Tafel" is that they do not relate to the English word. It will be hard to tell
this to translators and even harder for people that are not translators but simply use JOSM in a multi-lingual setting (e.g. English
tutorials, ...)

There is no need to follow the English original. I18N is more than a simple translation. This would not be the first case where the translation differs from the English original, see the German translation page for notes.

comment:31 Changed 3 months ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0817.09

comment:32 Changed 7 weeks ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.0917.10

comment:33 Changed 3 weeks ago by Don-vip

Milestone: 17.1017.11

comment:34 Changed 2 weeks ago by Don-vip

If we change it to "panel", I don't know how to rephrase this. "Toggle panels panel" is not great :D

    public DialogsToggleAction() {
        super(tr("Toggle dialogs panel"),
              (ImageProvider) null, /* no icon */
              tr("Toggle dialogs panel, maximize mapview"),
              Shortcut.registerShortcut("menu:view:dialogspanel", tr("Toggle dialogs panel"), KeyEvent.VK_TAB, Shortcut.DIRECT),
              true, "dialogspanel", /* register in toolbar */
              false
        );
        putValue("help", ht("/ToggleDialogs"));
        setSelected(Config.getPref().getBoolean("draw.dialogspanel", true));
        notifySelectedState();
    }
Last edited 2 weeks ago by Don-vip (previous) (diff)

comment:35 Changed 13 days ago by bastiK

In 13090/josm:

see #14142 - move dialogs toggle action menu entry down to toolbar toggle actions

comment:36 in reply to:  34 ; Changed 13 days ago by bastiK

Replying to Don-vip:

If we change it to "panel", I don't know how to rephrase this. "Toggle panels panel" is not great :D

There may be better wordings, but "Panel area" would be fine. (With [13090])

comment:37 in reply to:  36 Changed 13 days ago by Don-vip

Replying to bastiK:

"Panel area" would be fine

I like it :)

comment:38 Changed 13 days ago by Klumbumbus

I'm not yet really happy with the german translation (singular "Paneel", plural "Paneele"). When I hear "Paneele" I always think of this

(google picture search)

Last edited 13 days ago by Klumbumbus (previous) (diff)

comment:39 in reply to:  38 Changed 12 days ago by bastiK

Replying to michael2402:

Replying to stoecker:

Paneel → Paneele wäre die richtige Form. Wobei mir Feld oder Tafel besser gefallen würde.

Paneel/Paneele is acceptable. The problem with "Feld" and "Tafel" is that they do not relate to the English word. It will be hard to tell this to translators and even harder for people that are not translators but simply use JOSM in a multi-lingual setting (e.g. English tutorials, ...)

Replying to Klumbumbus:

I'm not yet really happy with the german translation (singular "Paneel", plural "Paneele"). When I hear "Paneele" I always think of this

What about "Bearbeitungsfeld" or "Arbeitsfeld", which can optionally be shortened to "Feld": "Ebenen-Bearbeitungsfeld", "Minikarten-Feld", "Bearbeitungsfeld für Kartenzeichenstile", ...

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